More Questions...

[Slutty Rimmer]

...than answers.

There is a lot of noise about another referendum yet I cannot begin to get behind the idea. Literally, because it is repeating the perceived problem of the last one i.e. the order is wrong. Before anyone begins to support or oppose another referendum it should surely be after the question has been agreed. It has now proved wise to first define precisely what the question should or could be, and to ensure it leaves no room for doubt. Also, would another referendum result be binding or would it also need to be voted on in parliament ?

Depending on the question I could either support it or oppose it. As it stands without the defining question we would again be agreeing to further uncertainty and disagreement to try and resolve the existing uncertainty and disagreement. Does multiple applications of confusion compound or cancel ?

What do peoples think the question should be ? That is the real question.

Maybe we need a referendum to decide if we need another referendum.

Otherwise, the answer has always been ‘let it be’.

Kind Regards,
The Fireman.

[geordiesouth]

No use shouting so I’ll whisper.
Lots of broken hearted people around but there will be an answer.

[Slutty Rimmer]

Originally Posted by geordiesouth

No use shouting so I’ll whisper.
Lots of broken hearted people around but there will be an answer.

...When we find ourselves in times of trouble, Mother Theresa comes to we,
Speaking words of wisdom; let it be Article 50 on March the 29th 2019 with an indefinite Irish backstop that threatens the long term integrity of the disunited United Kingdom.
And in our hour of darkness she is standing right in front of we,
Speaking words of wisdom; let it be voted on in Parliament by partisan and self-serving politicians of all persuasions who have only their own power obsessed ambitions at heart, not the collective good of the country.
And when the broken hearted people living in the world agree,
There will be an answer; let it be extremely unlikely that anybody is ever going to f*cking well agree on anything in these nasty and polarised tines no matter what the answer turns out to be.
For though they may be parted, there is still a chance that they will see,
There will be an answer; let it be then argued tediously to ad-infinitum what the original question meant in the first place*, but let’s have another undefined f*cking question anyway.

Kind Regards,
Arthur Dent.

* This reminds me of Deep Thought being asked the BIG question and after much extensive and painful thinking giving the answer, 42. Only for the people to realise they needed to build a new computer, Earth, in order to then understand what the question meant in the first place.

It turned out to be “What is 6 times 9 ?” but the question was lost and so they lied by just making up “How many roads must a man walk down ?”.

[Barstool]

Mother Theresa.....I like that

The trouble is, as the re-moaners keep remoanding us....the people who voted to leave are all really stupid and didn`t understand ...well anything really.

So what`s changed that will make a second vote more valid, have the `stupid ones` all been on intensive training courses to boost their ability to sift reality from bullshit.

It`s just so insulting but I suppose clutching at straws in a wind tunnel is all they have left.

I reckon a lot of people just wouldn`t vote if there was another one...crazy notion which wont be happening....I hope!

I think with what she had to work with, this agreement is probaly as good as we can expect, can you imagine JC and his bunch of goat heards being taken seriously in Brussels.

Boris for PM, no deal... mnnn, maybe we could emulate the general improvements made in The States recently, not so scary perhaps if you work reasonably hard and are an honest decent, legal citizen.

[Lisal]

I am a remainer and don't think there should be another referendum.

To be honest the whole remoaner thing is becoming boring and has come about because the brexiteers have realised that it wasn't going to be as easy as they thought and are trying to deflect from that fact. The cowardice of Rees-Mogg, Davis, (B) Johnson etc is overwhelming and JRM's appearance on the steps of HOC last week was nauseating.

One of my remainer friends said to me during the week that she felt sorry for Theresa May and I know where she is coming from. She has tried to appease all sides of her divided party (and yes I know Labour is horribly spilt too) plus the DUP and attempted to keep Europe on side, as well.

I suspect that the country is tired of the whole damn thing and just want it done. TM is probably thinking that if she grits it out the posturing politicians on all sides of the arguement will finally realise that and the deal can be finalised and we can get on with our lives.

Two years plus of this shambles and counting while pretty much everything apart from Brexit is on the back burner.

The last few polls have shown that, if there were another referendum, remain may well win. Seems the basis is that older voters have died, more younger voters are on the electoral roll and that younger voters will be more likely to get their butts down the polling station this time around

ETA

As said the question would be difficult and there is a real danger that you could end up with referendum after referendum.

Maybe a three choice question

Take the current deal

Exit with no deal

Stay in Europe

[geordiesouth]

What’s that you say Lisal,

“The Brexiteers now realise it isn’t as easy as they thought”

That’s exactly the problem.
Nobody had a clue what was/is involved.
People voted to remain or exit for all kinds of reasons.
If the bloody government had taken a bit more time and explained it all. The result may have been different. Or not.
But instead of Nigel ranting around we might have had some intelligence from people in the know.

[Lisal]

Originally Posted by geordiesouth

What’s that you say Lisal,

“The Brexiteers now realise it isn’t as easy as they thought”

That’s exactly the problem.
Nobody had a clue what was/is involved.
People voted to remain or exit for all kinds of reasons.
If the bloody government had taken a bit more time and explained it all. The result may have been different. Or not.
But instead of Nigel ranting around we might have had some intelligence from people in the know.

I don't always agree with you gs but spot on!

[Slutty Rimmer]

Originally Posted by Lisal

ETA

As said the question would be difficult and there is a real danger that you could end up with referendum after referendum.

Maybe a three choice question

Take the current deal

Exit with no deal

Stay in Europe

The problem with that choice is that it would be rightly perceived as a cynical attempt to divide and rule. The original minority remain vote would presumably still vote remain whilst the majority leave vote would be intentionally divided, thus allowing Remain to achieve their original intention.

I am a leaver who started out as a remainer.

Right now if the backstop threat to the unity of the Kingdom can be erased from the deal then I think the deal is not a bad one, and it is then the responsibility of all the MP’s to act in the Nation’s interest, rather than their own partisan interests.

Another referendum should not be needed. I hope Mother Theresa continues to show her resilience. Whatever your views on her politics there is no doubt she is that strange combination of fragility and toughness which is hard to replicate or to break. I think her heart is in the right place.

ETA*

In a bizarre way the last shambolic election may probably turn out better for the country as a whole. With the unionist DUP holding such influential power it is preventing the union with Northern Ireland being sacrificed to achieve an easier deal.

How many negotiations and hagglings are agreed at the first draft. Isn’t that the very reason it is classed as draft, because it is open to review and revision prior to rework and sign-off ? That is what I intend when I stamp my documents and reports as ‘DRAFT’ in bold Red letters. Indeed, I will strategically and purposefully put in frangible points in readiness to concede them at a later revision so as to preserve the core. Sacrificial offerings by design.

It is all pretty much run of the mill stuff at the moment, and I’m still quite sanguine about it all**.

Kind Regards,
The Fireman.

* ETA ? I am presuming that is a TLA which means Extra To Above ?

** !!!

[Lisal]

Oh sure.

I don't think it's anywhere near the ideal. But can't see how any new referendum would be.

ETA = Edited to Add

[Slutty Rimmer]

Originally Posted by Lisal

Oh sure.

I don't think it's anywhere near the ideal. But can't see how any new referendum would be.

ETA = Edited to Add

Yes. I liked the phrase ‘Don’t allow perfect to be the enemy of good’ which that bloke came out with on the old Question Time there the other night.

Kind Regards,
The Fireman.